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Alexander is Vronegg Urmi's half brother.
Profession and death:
Alexander handled the farm book and was an Ehegaumer. (morals checker) He was also a Constable in the Baregg died the 14th October 1676 (see death record at the end of this post)
Marriage:
Alexander married Anna Lüssi on 30 August 1643, in Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland. They were the parents of at least 9 sons and 7 daughters. Alexander and Anna lived in Baareg a small community near Knonau. Alexander's father Ueli Urmis was a Wachtmeisters (local policeman or I am not sure what all his duties were … some in "home office" ? 🤔 It did not have been a fully paid job - to earn his living he must have done something else. "Wachtmeister" was just an official position and as such mentioned in records.) most probably in Knnoau. See map below. Alexander's death date is unknown. The last time Anna is mentioned in the 1678 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis so she died thereafter.
Who are Aexander Urmi and Anna Lüssi's Children:
Alexander Urmi, ≈ Knonau 09.12.1618, in the Baregg, son of Ulrich, 1670 Ehegaumer, + 14.10.1676 (according to the register of the dead he was a constable). oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi of Zwillikon, “Ueli Lüßi's” daughter
Children:
1. 13.11.1644 Barbara (note to the baptismal entry: obiit Peste in Alsatia temp. messis [at harvest time] anno 1667)
2. 27.03.1646 Verena, oo Maschwanden 05.03.1679 Hans Stehli
3. 09.05.1647 Margreth (not mentioned in the population register 4. 1678, but lives with her brother Arbogast in 1683)
4. 27.08.1648 Ulrich, + 20.01.1649
5. 16.12.1649 Ulrich, oo 03.03.1678 Vollenweider Regula
6. 31.03.1651 Anna (mentioned in the population register 1678)
31.03.1651 Anna des Alexander Urmi und der Anna Leüssin in der Baregg31.03.1651 Anna (mentioned in the population register 1678), oo Mettmenstetten 11.08.1680 Oswald Wyß (Weiss) > daughter Barbeli ≈ 20.04.1684
C-4-6) 31.03.1651 Anna, oo 1680 Oswald Weiss
C-4-10) Arbogast Urmi oo 1683 Regula Ehrensperger
Post
Arbogast Urmi, ≈ Knonau 01.01.1657, Sohn des Alexander, + 23.11.1736
oo Knonau 14.11.1683
Regula Ehrensperger, Jakob Ehrenspergers sel. Tochter von Maschwanden
Kinder: alle getauft in Knonau
10.12.1684 Rudolf, oo 22.11.1713 Barbara Weilenmann, Heinis Tochter
24.05.1686 Jacob, + 23.03.1751
26.12.1687 Hans Jacob, + 23.01.1753
17.04.1690 Elßbeth
24.01.1694 Elßbeth, + 03.02.1694
7. 18.07.1652 Jakob (Jaggli), oo 20.04.1681 Adelheid Funk
8. 02.04.1654 Felix (note to the baptismal entry: obiit in der Frömde)
9. 02.09.1655 Hans Jakob, +30.08.1676
10. 01.01.1657 Arbogast oo 14.11.1683 (still listed as single in the population register 1683), + 23.11.1736
Post
Arbogast Urmi, ≈ Knonau 01.01.1657, Sohn des Alexander, + 23.11.1736
oo Knonau 14.11.1683
Regula Ehrensperger, Jakob Ehrenspergers sel. Tochter von Maschwanden
Kinder: alle getauft in Knonau
10.12.1684 Rudolf, oo 22.11.1713 Barbara Weilenmann, Heinis Tochter
24.05.1686 Jacob, + 23.03.1751
26.12.1687 Hans Jacob, + 23.01.1753
17.04.1690 Elßbeth
24.01.1694 Elßbeth, + 03.02.1694
16.03.1720 Buchmann, Heinrich (Caspars), getraut mit Urmi, Elisabeth, Baregg (nata 23. Junii 1695) [Tochter des Arbogast]
23.06.1695 Elßbeth, oo Maschwanden 16.03.1720 Heinrich Buchmann
12.06.1698 Verena, oo Kappel am Albis 06.12.1724 Christoph Grob von Hauptikon
11.06.1702 Anna
Taufen nach 1707 wurden nicht systematisch kontrolliert.
The 1750 BV is the one answers all questions - Verena's father is the one baptised 26.12.1687 as son of Arbogast: https://www.geneal-forum.com/phpbb/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=128378#p128378. I'll write up the post on Hans Jakob.
Kent: Vronegg and Alexander are from village of Baaragg, the parish is Knonau and that is where their birth records are located.
256) Alexander Urmi oo 1643 Anna Lüssi
Alexander Urmi, ≈ Knonau 09.12.1618, in der Baregg, Sohn des Ulrich, 1670 Ehegaumer, + vor 1678.
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi von Zwillikon, "Ueli Lüßis" Tochter
Kinder:
1. 13.11.1644 Barbara (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 nicht genannt) Wolf: obiit Peste in Alsatia temp. messis anno 1667. So Barbara died in Alsace from the plague during the harvest season 1667.
2. 27.03.1646 Verena, oo Maschwanden 05.03.1679 Hans Stehli
3. 09.05.1647 Margreth (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 nicht genannt, lebt aber 1683 bei ihrem Bruder Arbogast)
4. 27.08.1648 Ulrich, + 20.01.1649
5. 16.12.1649 Ulrich, oo 03.03.1678 Vollenweider Regula
7. 18.01.1652 Jakob (Jaggli), oo 20.04.1681 Adelheid Funk
C-4-10) Arbogast Urmi oo 1683 Regula Ehrensperger
Arbogast Urmi, ≈ Knonau 01.01.1657, Sohn des Alexander, + 23.11.1736
oo Knonau 14.11.1683
Regula Ehrensperger, Jakob Ehrenspergers sel. Tochter von Maschwanden
Kinder: alle getauft in Knonau
10.12.1684 Rudolf, oo 22.11.1713 Barbara Weilenmann, Heinis Tochter
24.05.1686 Jacob, + 23.03.1751
26.12.1687 Hans Jacob, + 23.01.1753
17.04.1690 Elßbeth
24.01.1694 Elßbeth, + 03.02.1694
23.06.1695 Elßbeth, oo Maschwanden 16.03.1720 Heinrich Buchmann
12.06.1698 Verena, oo Kappel am Albis 06.12.1724 Christoph Grob von Hauptikon
11.06.1702 Anna
Taufen nach 1707 wurden nicht systematisch kontrolliert.
16. 09.03.1670 Barbara, lebt 1683 bei ihrem Bruder Jaggeli
Wolf: I just came across an interesting entry on Knonau-Tauf-1644-1645-film 008014288-page104.jpg:
No further children are mentioned in the population register of 1634.
4 lines Urmi from Knonau ZH
Based solely on the church records of Knonau, no common progenitor of all known Urmi of Knonau can be determined. Rather, there are 4 bearers of the name in the early church records to whom no parents can be assigned. Their descendants are summarized below as lines A ... D. In addition to the markings shown below, there are numbers {nnn} in curved brackets: these Kekule numbers refer to Johann Robert Urmi (20.10.1891-27.08.1982) as the proband.
Ulrich Urmi ooI Margreth Zürcher, ooII Anna Kueni, ooIII Margaretha Walder {512}
Wife 1 Margreth Zürcher
23.06.1695 Elßbeth, oo Maschwanden 16.03.1720 Heinrich Buchmann
12.06.1698 Verena, oo Kappel am Albis 06.12.1724 Christoph Grob von Hauptikon
11.06.1702 Anna
Taufen nach 1707 wurden nicht systematisch kontrolliert.
The 1750 BV is the one answers all questions - Verena's father is the one baptised 26.12.1687 as son of Arbogast: https://www.geneal-forum.com/phpbb/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=128378#p128378. I'll write up the post on Hans Jakob.
11. 29.05.1659 Heinrich, + 16.08.1676
12. 06.01.1661 Hans Rudolf (mentioned in the population register 1678)
C-4-12) Hans Rudolf Urmi oo 1684 Veronika Funk
Hans Rudolf Urmi, ≈ Knonau 06.01.1661, son of Alexander [§]
oo Mettmenstetten 06.08.1684 “Married in Mettmenstetten; meal in the Obermettmenstetten inn”
Veronika Funk, Hansen des Lismer's daughter from Obermettmenstetten.
[According to the marriage entry “Xanders sel. son. He has bought into Uerzlikon, but has not yet moved there.”
Hans Rudolf Urmi, ≈ Knonau 06.01.1661, son of Alexander [§]
oo Mettmenstetten 06.08.1684 “Married in Mettmenstetten; meal in the Obermettmenstetten inn”
Veronika Funk, Hansen des Lismer's daughter from Obermettmenstetten.
[According to the marriage entry “Xanders sel. son. He has bought into Uerzlikon, but has not yet moved there.”
13. 13.02.1662 Verena, + 12.05.1683
14. 13.03.1664 Alexander, + 1671 [§]
[§] Alexander's baptismal entry (13.03.1664) states “obiit den 14ten vor Weÿnacht 1671”. According to the death entry, he died “about 2 weeks before Weÿnacht” in 1671.
15. 19.11.1665 Elisabeth, + 01.09.1676
16. 09.03.1670 Barbara, lives with her brother Jaggeli in 1683
Children according to Knonau population registers 1649 and 1670 (supplemented with exact baptism dates from familysearch and details in the Zurich marriage database):
How is Alexander related to the Sidlers?
When Jakob Sidler 1608 -1693 (Wagner and Magister) and
Vronegg Urmi had their last child named Anna in 1644. Anna Sidler's Godmother was Anna Lüssi who is the wife of Alexander. Alexander is also Vronegg's half brother.
Vronegg Urmi had their last child named Anna in 1644. Anna Sidler's Godmother was Anna Lüssi who is the wife of Alexander. Alexander is also Vronegg's half brother.
Wolf: Baregg was a hamlet with just a few houses - no-one was baptized there. Children born in Baregg were baptised in Knonau. Vronegg was baptised in Knonau. We have several connections between families in Ottenbach and Knonau (Baregg) - so it would not be a surprise if Anna Lüssi and Anna Sidler (via Vronegg) were somehow related. A possible connection would be on https://www.geneal-forum.com/phpbb/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=34111#p128289 leading to the comment bottom of https://www.geneal-forum.com/phpbb/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=34111#p128296 ... possibly Anna Lüssi's husband is just not mentioned in 1644?
256) Alexander Urmi oo 1643 Anna Lüssi
Alexander Urmi, ≈ Knonau 09.12.1618, in der Baregg, Sohn des Ulrich, 1670 Ehegaumer, + vor 1678.
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi von Zwillikon, "Ueli Lüßis" Tochter
Kinder:
1. 13.11.1644 Barbara (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 nicht genannt) Wolf: obiit Peste in Alsatia temp. messis anno 1667. So Barbara died in Alsace from the plague during the harvest season 1667.
2. 27.03.1646 Verena, oo Maschwanden 05.03.1679 Hans Stehli
3. 09.05.1647 Margreth (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 nicht genannt, lebt aber 1683 bei ihrem Bruder Arbogast)
4. 27.08.1648 Ulrich, + 20.01.1649
5. 16.12.1649 Ulrich, oo 03.03.1678 Vollenweider Regula
C-4-5) Ulrich Urmi oo 1678 Regula Vollenweider
Ulrich Urmi, ≈ 16.12.1649, son of Alexander and Anna Lüssi, becomes Ehegaumer in 1684
oo Knonau 03.03.1678 (family lives in the Baregg in 1683)
Vollenweider Regula, daughter of Gorius Vollenweider of Rossau
Children:
13.12.1679 Hanßli (3 years old in 1683)
15.05.1681 Hans
18.09.1682 Anneli (1683 1½-year-old)
03.02.1684 Ulrich, 1712 in Zurich, oo 1717 Maria Attinger
6. 31.03.1651 Anna (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 genannt)7. 18.01.1652 Jakob (Jaggli), oo 20.04.1681 Adelheid Funk
128) Jakob Urmi oo 1681 Adelheid Funk
Jakob (Jaggli) Urmi, ≈ Knonau 18.01.1652, son of Alexander.
oo Knonau 20.04.1681
Adelheid Funk from Obermettmenstetten, ≈ 16.11.1651.
They are old and simple people who moved here from the Baregg, where their house has gone to ruin, and therefore there is no complaint from them. (Source: Maschwanden family register 1721/22).
In 1717 the eldest son Heinrich marries in Maschwanden - Jakob and his family must therefore have moved to Maschwanden between about 1700 and 1717 - or did he follow his son after 1717?
Children:
09.04.1682 Heini, + 06.05.1682
29.06.1684 Heinrich (Heini) oo Elßj Stauder
24.06.1686 Vrenj, serves 1721/22 in Alsace
09.10.1687 Anna, ooI 1720 Hans Jakob Hägi, ooII 1729 Hans Jakob Bär
07.12.1690 Jakob (Jaggj), Sartor
09.01.1698 Hanß, serves 1721/22 in Alsace
07.04.1700 Barbara, + 31.05.1700
Baptisms after 1700 were not systematically checked..
8. 02.09.1655 Hans Jakob, +30.08.16769. 02.04.1654 Felix (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 nicht genannt) (Felix …. Wäber (weaver) / Margretha Meÿerin
Wolf: (Felix was a weaver. Another one on Knonau-Tauf-1653-1654-film008014288-page113.jpg:
02.04.1654 Felix, son of Alexander Urmi and Anna Leüssin in der Baregg, obiit in der Frömde.
So Felix died abroad.)
02.04.1654 Felix, son of Alexander Urmi and Anna Leüssin in der Baregg, obiit in der Frömde.
So Felix died abroad.)
10. 01.01.1657 Arbogast oo 14.11.1683 (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1683 noch als ledig geführt)
(See birth of Argogast's daughter Anna 1702 below. His wife is Regula Ehrensperger b 1660 ID: G6PV-RT6. They had 7 children)
C-4-10) Arbogast Urmi oo 1683 Regula Ehrensperger
Arbogast Urmi, ≈ Knonau 01.01.1657, Sohn des Alexander, + 23.11.1736
oo Knonau 14.11.1683
Regula Ehrensperger, Jakob Ehrenspergers sel. Tochter von Maschwanden
Kinder: alle getauft in Knonau
10.12.1684 Rudolf, oo 22.11.1713 Barbara Weilenmann, Heinis Tochter
24.05.1686 Jacob, + 23.03.1751
26.12.1687 Hans Jacob, + 23.01.1753
17.04.1690 Elßbeth
24.01.1694 Elßbeth, + 03.02.1694
23.06.1695 Elßbeth, oo Maschwanden 16.03.1720 Heinrich Buchmann
12.06.1698 Verena, oo Kappel am Albis 06.12.1724 Christoph Grob von Hauptikon
11.06.1702 Anna
Taufen nach 1707 wurden nicht systematisch kontrolliert.
C-4-10-3) Hans Jacob Urmi oo 1722 Katharina Kleiner
Hans Jacob Urmi, ≈ Knonau 26.12.1687, Sohn von Arbogast, 1750 Ehegaumer, wohnhaft in der Unter-Baregg, + 23.01.1753.
oo Knonau 02.05.1722 "propter perpetratam lasciviam coronis indigni"
Katharina Kleiner von Maschwanden, ≈ 18.05.1689
Kinder (laut Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1750):
23.04.1724 Barbara
06.10.1726 Verena, oo Ottenbach 25.01.1752 Hans Schneebeli, Heinrichs sel. Sohn
12.02.1730 Hans Jacob
Evtl. weitere, aber vor 1750 verheiratete oder verstorbene Kinder sind im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis nicht aufgelistet.
Hans Jacob Urmi, ≈ Knonau 26.12.1687, Sohn von Arbogast, 1750 Ehegaumer, wohnhaft in der Unter-Baregg, + 23.01.1753.
oo Knonau 02.05.1722 "propter perpetratam lasciviam coronis indigni"
Katharina Kleiner von Maschwanden, ≈ 18.05.1689
Kinder (laut Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1750):
23.04.1724 Barbara
06.10.1726 Verena, oo Ottenbach 25.01.1752 Hans Schneebeli, Heinrichs sel. Sohn
12.02.1730 Hans Jacob
Evtl. weitere, aber vor 1750 verheiratete oder verstorbene Kinder sind im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis nicht aufgelistet.
10.12.1684 Rudolf, oo 22.11.1713 Barbara Weilenmann, Heini's daughter
C-4-10-1) Rudi Urmi oo 1713 Barbara Weilenmann (in Maschwanden)
Rudi Urmi, ≈ Knonau 10.12.1684, son of Arbogast, innkeeper and weaver. “Had as long as he worked in the trade a good ... ... .... ... the innkeeper's house dissolute: and devoted to drink.”
oo Maschwanden 22.11.1713
Barbara Weilenmann, ≈ 09.06.1689, Heini's daughter
Children:
07.11.1714 Hans >>> Maschwanden
25.07.1717 Hans Jacob
13.__.1719 Rudi
08.10.1721 Anna
Source: Maschwanden family register 1721/22 (E III 73.6) with additions
24.05.1686 Jacob, + 23.03.1751
26.12.1687 Hans Jacob, + 23.01.1753
17.04.1690 Elßbeth
24.01.1694 Elßbeth, + 03.02.1694
23.06.1695 Elßbeth, oo Maschwanden 16.03.1720 Heinrich Buchmann
12.06.1698 Verena, oo Kappel am Albis 06.12.1724 Christoph Grob von Hauptikon
Baptisms after 1700 were not systematically checked.
11. 29.05.1659 Heinrich, + 1672
12. 06.01.1661 Hans Rudolf (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 genannt)
13. 13.02.1662 Verena, + 12.05.1683
14. 13.03.1664 Alexander, + 1671
12. 06.01.1661 Hans Rudolf (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678 genannt)
13. 13.02.1662 Verena, + 12.05.1683
14. 13.03.1664 Alexander, + 1671
Wolf: And one more on Knonau-Tauf-1663-1664-film008014288-page121.jpg:
13.03.1664 Alexander, obiit 14. vor (Weihnacht?) 1671
Unfortunately there is a blot over the entry: it would be helpful if you could provide a copy of this page in full resolution.
Alexander died in 1671 on a 14th prior to some holidy (Xmas??): possibly you could find a death record in 1671 clarifying the issue.
16. 09.03.1670 Barbara, lebt 1683 bei ihrem Bruder Jaggeli
Wolf: I just came across an interesting entry on Knonau-Tauf-1644-1645-film 008014288-page104.jpg:
Kinder gemäss Bevölkerungsverzeichnissen Knonau 1649 und 1670 (ergänzt mit genauen Taufdaten aus familysearch und Angaben in der Zürcher Ehedatenbank):
Alexander's father is Ulrich's and his mother is Ulrich's 3rd wife.
Wolf: summary of Vronegg's father, Ulrich and mother Margreth Zürcher
512) Ulrich Urmi Wife 1 Margreth Zürcher, Wife 2 Anna Kueni, Wife 3 Margaretha Walder
Ulrich Urmi “uß der Baregg”, constable, + between 1640 and 1643
Wife 1
Margreth Zürcher [§]
Children:
1. 27.01.1602 Hans oo 11.02.1629 Baur Barbara (vidua) > son Rudolf 23.12.1632
C-1) Hans Urmi oo 1629 Barbara Bauer
Hans Urmi, ≈ 27.01.1602 Knonau, son of Ulrich and Margreth Zürcher
oo Knonau 11.02.1629
Barbara Baur, widow from Wettswil am Albis
son:
23.12.1632 Rudol
2. 10.11.1605 Froneck (Veronika) oo 03.02.1629 Jakob Sidler
3. Ulrich Urmi
Wife 2 Knonau 20.03.1608
Anna Kueni from Knonau
Children: 1608-1617 none found
Ulrich Urmi
Wife 3 Knonau 12.01.1617
Margaretha Walder from Knonau
According to the marriage entry of 1643, Alexander Urmi is “Ueli Urmi's own westerly constable's son in the Baregg”. [A marriage entry for Uli Urmi with Margreth Zürcher is not found - they may have married between 1584 and 1601 (gap in the Knonau marriage register). The wife's name is only known from the two child baptisms. Uli Urmi was a widower when he married in 1608.Children:
1. 02.11.1617 Anna (not mentioned in the population register of 1634 - therefore probably deceased before)
3. 03.09.1620 Margreth, serves in the Hoff Buch in 1640,married 19.01.1642 Frick Hans “Heini Fricken” son of Knonau.No further children are mentioned in the population register of 1634.
Wolf: According to the marriage entry of 1643, Alexander Urmi is “Ueli Urmi's own westerly constable's son in the Baregg”.
[The only definite reference to the marriage is the description of Ulrich Urmi as a widower when he married in 1608.
On 10.11.1605 Vronegg Urmi, daughter of Ulrich(?) Urmi and Margreth Zürcher, “uß der Baregk” is baptized in Knonau: Margreth Zürcher could be this first wife and Vronegg a child from the first marriage.
[The only definite reference to the marriage is the description of Ulrich Urmi as a widower when he married in 1608.
On 10.11.1605 Vronegg Urmi, daughter of Ulrich(?) Urmi and Margreth Zürcher, “uß der Baregk” is baptized in Knonau: Margreth Zürcher could be this first wife and Vronegg a child from the first marriage.
Based solely on the church records of Knonau, no common progenitor of all known Urmi of Knonau can be determined. Rather, there are 4 bearers of the name in the early church records to whom no parents can be assigned. Their descendants are summarized below as lines A ... D. In addition to the markings shown below, there are numbers {nnn} in curved brackets: these Kekule numbers refer to Johann Robert Urmi (20.10.1891-27.08.1982) as the proband.
Wife 1 Margreth Zürcher
1. 27.01.1602 Hans (MZ) oo 11.02.1629 Baur Barbara
child: 23.12.1632 Rudolf
2. 10.11.1605 Froneck (MZ) oo 03.02.1629 Jakob Sidler
3. 02.11.1617 Anna (MW)
child: 23.12.1632 Rudolf
2. 10.11.1605 Froneck (MZ) oo 03.02.1629 Jakob Sidler
3. 02.11.1617 Anna (MW)
Wife 2 Anna Kueni
no known children
Wife 3 Margaretha Walder from Knonau
1. 02.11.1617 Anna
2. 09.12.1618 Alexander (MW) oo 30.08.1643 Anna Lüssi, + 14.10.1676 {256}
1. 13.11.1644 Barbara
2. 27.03.1646 Verena oo 05.03.1679
3. 09.05.1647 Margreth
4. 27.08.1648 Ulrich, + 20.01.1649
5. 16.12.1649 Ulrich oo 03.03.1678 Regula Vollenweider
C-4-5-1) 13.12.1679 Hanßli
C-4-5-2) 18.09.1682 Anneli
6. 31.03.1651 Anna
7. 18.07.1652 Jakob oo 20.04.1681 Adelheid Funk {128}
8. 02.04.1654 Felix, obiit in der Frömde
9. 02.09.1655 Hans Jakob, +30.08.1676
10. 01.01.1657 Arbogast oo 14.11.1683, + 23.11.1736
11. 29.05.1659 Heinrich, + 16.08.1676
12. 06.01.1661 Hans Rudolf
13. 13.02.1662 Verena, + 12.05.1683
14. 13.03.1664 Alexander, + 1671
15. 19.11.1665 Elisabeth, + 01.09.1676
16. 09.03.1670 Barbara
3. 03.09.1620 Margreth (MW)
2. 09.12.1618 Alexander (MW) oo 30.08.1643 Anna Lüssi, + 14.10.1676 {256}
1. 13.11.1644 Barbara
2. 27.03.1646 Verena oo 05.03.1679
3. 09.05.1647 Margreth
4. 27.08.1648 Ulrich, + 20.01.1649
5. 16.12.1649 Ulrich oo 03.03.1678 Regula Vollenweider
C-4-5-1) 13.12.1679 Hanßli
C-4-5-2) 18.09.1682 Anneli
6. 31.03.1651 Anna
7. 18.07.1652 Jakob oo 20.04.1681 Adelheid Funk {128}
8. 02.04.1654 Felix, obiit in der Frömde
9. 02.09.1655 Hans Jakob, +30.08.1676
10. 01.01.1657 Arbogast oo 14.11.1683, + 23.11.1736
11. 29.05.1659 Heinrich, + 16.08.1676
12. 06.01.1661 Hans Rudolf
13. 13.02.1662 Verena, + 12.05.1683
14. 13.03.1664 Alexander, + 1671
15. 19.11.1665 Elisabeth, + 01.09.1676
16. 09.03.1670 Barbara
3. 03.09.1620 Margreth (MW)
Wolf:
512) Ulrich Urmi ooI Margreth Zürcher, ooII Anna Kueni, ooIII Margaretha Walder
Post by Wolf » Sun 15. Sep 2024, 12:08
Ulrich Urmi "uß der Baregg", Wachtmeister, + Knonau 28.03.1643
ooI
Margreth Zürcher, [§]
Kinder:
27.01.1602 Hans oo 11.02.1629 Baur Barbara (vidua)
10.11.1605 Froneck (Veronika) oo 03.02.1629 Jakob Sidler
Ulrich Urmi
ooII Knonau 20.03.1608
Anna Kueni von Knonau
Kinder: 1608-1617 keine gefunden
Ulrich Urmi
ooIII Knonau 12.01.1617
Margaretha Walder, ≈ Knonau 22.08.1594 als Tochter des Felix und der Anna Baur (kein Heiratseintrag gefunden), + Knonau 20.10.1644
Kinder:
02.11.1617 Anna (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1634 nicht genannt - ist also vmtl. vorher verstorben)
09.12.1618 Alexander, dient 1640 im Hoff Buch
03.09.1620 Margreth, dient 1640 im Hoff Buch, oo 19.01.1642 Frick Hans "Heini Fricken" Sohn von Knonau.
Im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1634 werden keine weiteren Kinder genannt.
Laut Heiratseintrag von 1643 ist Alexander Urmi "Ueli Urmis sel. gewäsnen Wachtmeisters in der Baregg ehelich hinderlaßner Sohn".
[§] Ein Heiratseintrag Uli Urmi mit Margreth Zürcher findet sich nicht - vmtl. haben sie zwischen 1584 und 1601 (Lücke im Ehebuch Knonau) geheiratet. Der Name der Ehefrau ist nur aus den beiden Kindstaufen bekannt. Bei der Heirat 1608 war Uli Urmi Witwer.
Die Kekule-Nummer (512) bezieht sich auf Johann Robert Urmi (20.10.1891-27.08.1982) als Probanden.
Wolf:
Wolf:
We have 3 Urmi marriages on this page:
11.02.1616 Felix Vrmi vß der Baregg & Elsbetha Grobin zu Knonouw
12.01.1617 Vli Vrmi vß der Baregg, viduus & Margaretha Walderin zu Knonouw
03.05.1626 Hans Künradt Vrmi & Agnes Heggetschwÿller, beide zu Kno(nouw)
Note: There is no proven relationship between these three - best seen on 4 Linien Urmi von Knonau ZH: Felix listed as D / Ulrich listed as C / Hans Konrad listed as A-1.
Wolf:
Kinder: Alexander, ein ehl(iches) Kind
Parents: Vli Vrmi, Margreth Walder vß der Bareg
Godparents: Alexander Freÿ zu Knonouw, Elsbeth Grobin zu Knonouw
9 Dece(m)br(is) [1618]
Wolf:
Margreth, ein ehl(iches) Kind
Vli Vrmi, Margreth Walder vß d(er) Baldeg
Heinrich Trümpler von Rüschlikon
Margreth Frÿgin (= Frei) vß der Baldegg
3. Herpstmonat [1620]
Wolf:
Uolrich Vrmj vnd Margretha Walderin
Alexander, 15½ järig, kan auch den kürtzren [...?]
Margretha, 13½ järig, kann bätten [beten], die H(eiligen) 10 gebott
Felix Vrminn vnd Adelhrita Grobin
Gourius, 11½ järig kann bätten [beten], die H(eiligen) 10 gebott
Verena, 4½ järig
Anna 3 jär(ig)
Köngeli [Küngeli = Küngold], Järig
This information had already been incorporated in the summary table.
Wolf:
1643. den 30. Augstmonat hand Hochzÿt ghalten: Uoli Urmis sel(ig) gewäsner Wachtmeister in der Baregg ehelicher hinderlaßner Sohn: mit nammen Alexander : und Uoli Lüßis von Zwillikon, eheliche Tochter mit nammen Anna: warend zuovor noch beide ledig.
On 30 August 1643 held wedding: Alexander, the late Uli Urmi's, former constable in Baregg, son, and Uli Lüssi's daughter Anna from Zwillikon. Both had previously been unmarried.
Wolf:
den 20. Octobr(is) [1644] starb Margretha Walder; Vli Vrmiß Séligen, gewäsnen Wachtmeisters vß der Baregg, Eheliche hinder(laßne) Wittfrauw.
Note: The last line is partially obscured - but hinder(laßne) Wittfrauw would be the standard text for a widow
Wolf:
Alexander Vrmi, der Ehegaumer vnd Anna Leüsßj
Ihre 3 Kinder:
Barbelj, 4 jahr, 25 woch(en) allt
Vrendlj, 3 jahr v(nd) 6 woch(en) allt
Gertlj, 2 jahr alt
I have summarized this plus the data from 1670 in a table on Geneal-Forum.
Wolf:
256) Alexander Urmi oo 1643 Anna Lüssi
Alexander Urmi, ≈ Knonau 09.12.1618, in the Baregg, son of Ulrich, 1670 Ehegaumer.
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi of Zwillikon, “Ueli Lüßi's” daughter
Children (further children not yet consistently sought):
27.03.1646 Verena, oo Maschwanden 05.03.1679 Hans Stehli
18.01.1652 Jaggli
Children according to Knonau population registers 1649 and 1670 (supplemented with exact baptism data from familysearch and the Zurich marriage database):
Wolf:
III Baregg
Vnden für dem Hof Buch
A. Anna Leüssin; Vander (= Alexander) Vrmiß Sël(ig) Eheliche hinderlassene Wittfr(au)w, Deren Kinder.
1. Verena - 32 Jahr vnd 6 w(ochen), dienet zu Zwilliken
2. Anna - 27 Jahr vnd 3 woch(en), dienet im Buch
3. Jagli - 25½ Jahr vnd 15 w(ochen), dienet zu Mëttma(n)stetten
4. Arbogast - 21 Jahr vnd 18 woch(en). Ist wol-erfahren in Catecheticis; v(nd) communiciert.
5. Hanß Rudj - 17 Jahr vnd 17 woch(en). Recitat Testimonia [S(cit)?] vnd kann die vorgehenden Stuck [..]
6. Vrendlj - 16 Jahr vnd 3 woch(en). Scit fragmenta.
7. Barbelj - 8 Jährig vnd 8 wöchig, scit Triadem püopularem.
Ibidem Ehe-Leüth:
Vllj Vrmj; deren obverzeichneten Kinderen Bruder vnnd Rëgel Vollenweider
Missing on the list is Margreth (≈ 09.05.1647 > 31 years) who in 1683 lives with her brother Arbogast.
Missing on the list is Margreth (≈ 09.05.1647 > 31 years) who in 1683 lives with her brother Arbogast.
512) Ulrich Urmi ooI Margreth Zürcher, ooII Anna Kueni, ooIII Margaretha Walder
Post by Wolf » Sun 15. Sep 2024, 12:08
Ulrich Urmi "uß der Baregg", Wachtmeister, + Knonau 28.03.1643
ooI
Margreth Zürcher, [§]
Kinder:
27.01.1602 Hans oo 11.02.1629 Baur Barbara (vidua)
10.11.1605 Froneck (Veronika) oo 03.02.1629 Jakob Sidler
Ulrich Urmi
ooII Knonau 20.03.1608
Anna Kueni von Knonau
Kinder: 1608-1617 keine gefunden
Ulrich Urmi
ooIII Knonau 12.01.1617
Margaretha Walder, ≈ Knonau 22.08.1594 als Tochter des Felix und der Anna Baur (kein Heiratseintrag gefunden), + Knonau 20.10.1644
Kinder:
02.11.1617 Anna (wird im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1634 nicht genannt - ist also vmtl. vorher verstorben)
09.12.1618 Alexander, dient 1640 im Hoff Buch
03.09.1620 Margreth, dient 1640 im Hoff Buch, oo 19.01.1642 Frick Hans "Heini Fricken" Sohn von Knonau.
Im Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1634 werden keine weiteren Kinder genannt.
Laut Heiratseintrag von 1643 ist Alexander Urmi "Ueli Urmis sel. gewäsnen Wachtmeisters in der Baregg ehelich hinderlaßner Sohn".
[§] Ein Heiratseintrag Uli Urmi mit Margreth Zürcher findet sich nicht - vmtl. haben sie zwischen 1584 und 1601 (Lücke im Ehebuch Knonau) geheiratet. Der Name der Ehefrau ist nur aus den beiden Kindstaufen bekannt. Bei der Heirat 1608 war Uli Urmi Witwer.
Die Kekule-Nummer (512) bezieht sich auf Johann Robert Urmi (20.10.1891-27.08.1982) als Probanden.
Documents related to Alexander Urmi:
 |
| 1594 Margreth Walder baptism parents: Felix Walder-Anna Bur 22 Aug Knonau film 008014288 page 65 |
Transcription:
Margreth ein ehliche Dochter Felix Walders vnd Anna Bur ward getauft den 22. tag Augsten Anno 1594.
Margreth ein ehliche Dochter Felix Walders vnd Anna Bur ward getauft den 22. tag Augsten Anno 1594.
Zügen warend Herr Anderes Bräm der zitt EmdtVogt der Herrschaft Knonouw vnd Margreth Gallman.
Note: Bur could be Baur or Bauer today - no entry in Zürcher Ehedatenbank.
der zitt EmdtVogt der Herrschaft Knonouw: at the time "Amtmann" (bailiff) of the Knonau district.
Note: Bur could be Baur or Bauer today - no entry in Zürcher Ehedatenbank.
der zitt EmdtVogt der Herrschaft Knonouw: at the time "Amtmann" (bailiff) of the Knonau district.
Translation:
Margreth, a legitimate daughter of Felix Walder and Anna Bur, was baptized on the 22nd day of August 1594.
The witnesses were Mr. Anderes Bräm, the time bailiff of the lordship of Knonouw, and Margreth Gallman.
Note: Bur could be Baur or Bauer today - no entry in Zürcher Ehedatenatenbank.
der zitt EmdtVogt der Herrschaft Knonouw: at the time “Amtmann” (bailiff) of the Knonau district.
 |
| 1617 Uli Urmi marriage to Margetha Walderin 12 Jan Knonau film 008014288 page 126 |
We have 3 Urmi marriages on this page:
11.02.1616 Felix Vrmi vß der Baregg & Elsbetha Grobin zu Knonouw
12.01.1617 Vli Vrmi vß der Baregg, viduus & Margaretha Walderin zu Knonouw
03.05.1626 Hans Künradt Vrmi & Agnes Heggetschwÿller, beide zu Kno(nouw)
Note: There is no proven relationship between these three - best seen on 4 Linien Urmi von Knonau ZH: Felix listed as D / Ulrich listed as C / Hans Konrad listed as A-1.
 |
| 1618 Alexander Urmi baptism 9 December Father Urmi mother Margreth Walder Knonau film page 82 |
Kinder: Alexander, ein ehl(iches) Kind
Parents: Vli Vrmi, Margreth Walder vß der Bareg
Godparents: Alexander Freÿ zu Knonouw, Elsbeth Grobin zu Knonouw
9 Dece(m)br(is) [1618]
 |
| 1620 Margreta Urmi bap Üli Urmi and Margreth Walder 3 Sep Knonau film 008014288 page 83 |
Margreth, ein ehl(iches) Kind
Vli Vrmi, Margreth Walder vß d(er) Baldeg
Heinrich Trümpler von Rüschlikon
Margreth Frÿgin (= Frei) vß der Baldegg
3. Herpstmonat [1620]
 |
| 1634 Knonau Census film 008126308 page 270 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis |
Uolrich Vrmj vnd Margretha Walderin
Alexander, 15½ järig, kan auch den kürtzren [...?]
Margretha, 13½ järig, kann bätten [beten], die H(eiligen) 10 gebott
Felix Vrminn vnd Adelhrita Grobin
Gourius, 11½ järig kann bätten [beten], die H(eiligen) 10 gebott
Verena, 4½ järig
Anna 3 jär(ig)
Köngeli [Küngeli = Küngold], Järig
This information had already been incorporated in the summary table.
 |
| Urmi Summary Table from Wolf |
 |
| 1643 Alexander Urmi marriage 30 Aug to Anna Lüßin Knonau page 127 |
1643. den 30. Augstmonat hand Hochzÿt ghalten: Uoli Urmis sel(ig) gewäsner Wachtmeister in der Baregg ehelicher hinderlaßner Sohn: mit nammen Alexander : und Uoli Lüßis von Zwillikon, eheliche Tochter mit nammen Anna: warend zuovor noch beide ledig.
On 30 August 1643 held wedding: Alexander, the late Uli Urmi's, former constable in Baregg, son, and Uli Lüssi's daughter Anna from Zwillikon. Both had previously been unmarried.
Säntis:
According to the marriage entry from 1643, Alexander Urmi is “Ueli Urmi's own westerly constable's son in the Baregg”.
Wolf:
Alexander Urmi, in der Baregg
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi von Zwillikon, "Ueli Lüßis" Tochter
Wolf:
According to the marriage entry from 1643, Alexander Urmi is “Ueli Urmi's own westerly constable's son in the Baregg”.
Wolf:
Alexander Urmi, in der Baregg
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi von Zwillikon, "Ueli Lüßis" Tochter
Wolf:
Knonau 30.08.1643: Urmi Alexander & Lüssi Anna
"Ueli Urmis sel. gewäsnen Wachtmeisters in der Baregg ehelich hinderlaßner Sohn"
"Ueli Urmis sel. gewäsnen Wachtmeisters in der Baregg ehelich hinderlaßner Sohn"
 |
| 1644 March 28 Ulrich Urmi, Wachtmeister !!! Baaragg burial film 008014288 page 131 |
 |
| 1644 Oct 20 .Margaretha Walder, widow of Ulrich Urmi Baaragg burial film 008014288 page 131 |
den 20. Octobr(is) [1644] starb Margretha Walder; Vli Vrmiß Séligen, gewäsnen Wachtmeisters vß der Baregg, Eheliche hinder(laßne) Wittfrauw.
Note: The last line is partially obscured - but hinder(laßne) Wittfrauw would be the standard text for a widow
 |
| 1644 Alexander's daughter: Barbara Urmi bap 13 Nov Knonau film 008014288 page 104 |
 |
| 1649 Alexander Urmi and Anna Lüßin Bevölkerungsverzeichnis Knonau film 008126304 page 161 |
Alexander Vrmi, der Ehegaumer vnd Anna Leüsßj
Ihre 3 Kinder:
Barbelj, 4 jahr, 25 woch(en) allt
Vrendlj, 3 jahr v(nd) 6 woch(en) allt
Gertlj, 2 jahr alt
I have summarized this plus the data from 1670 in a table on Geneal-Forum.
Ehegaumer is an ecclesiastical judge of morals, watching for bigamy, illegitimacy and heresy.
An Ehegaumer is a Sittenrichter/Eherichter; I found an explanation for the term in an article about moral courts in the "Historisches Lexikon der Schweiz" (https://hls-dhs-dss.ch/de/articles/007476/). Searching the page for Ehegaumer (CTRL+F brings up a search, or Command+F if on a Mac) brings you to a paragraph about marriage courts Another online site explained that an Ehegaumer is a person who has to watch about religion, morals, and order. In other words, it's a marriage judge, or a judge of people's morals in general. The Geneal-Forum contains helpful explanations too, including the following translated sentences: "The [Ehegaumer] had to watch over the morals of the church members, in particular over married and family life, the observance of Sundays and church attendance. People whose way of life left something to be desired could be summoned to standstill, admonished and - if that didn't work - reported to the bailiff. The number of Ehegaumer depended on the size of the parish and the more important settlements it contained. The Ehegaumer were elected for three-year terms, while the clergymen served until their resignation or death."
 |
| 1664 Alexander Urmi (son's) baptism 13 Mar Parents Alexander and Anna Leüssin Knonau film 008014288 page 121 |
 |
| 1670 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis - Baregger, Knonau Alexander Urmi film 007765846 page 334 |
256) Alexander Urmi oo 1643 Anna Lüssi
Alexander Urmi, ≈ Knonau 09.12.1618, in the Baregg, son of Ulrich, 1670 Ehegaumer.
oo Knonau 30.08.1643
Anna Lüssi of Zwillikon, “Ueli Lüßi's” daughter
Children (further children not yet consistently sought):
27.03.1646 Verena, oo Maschwanden 05.03.1679 Hans Stehli
18.01.1652 Jaggli
Children according to Knonau population registers 1649 and 1670 (supplemented with exact baptism data from familysearch and the Zurich marriage database):
 | |
|
 |
| The Kekule number (256) refers to Johann Robert Urmi (20.10.1891-27.08.1982) as the subject |
Verena's note: obit noted in the baptismal entry
 |
| 1676 Hans Jakob bur Aug 30 Knonau Film 008014288 page 355 and burial of Alexander Urmi b 1618 burial 14.10.1676 |
Wolf:
(15) 18.08.1676
Heÿni, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Ehelicher Söhnen einer, 17 Jahr vnd 12 Wochen Allt, der starb den 18. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
Ehelicher Söhnen einer = one of his legitimate sons.
(18) 30.08.1676 see previous topic
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in der Baregg, ehelicher 21-jähriger Sohn, starb den 30. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
(21) 01.09.1676
Elßeli, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Eheliches Eeinlef-Jähriges Töchterlj [minder XI wochen] Starb den 1. tag Septembris [1676].
Eeinlef = elf (eleven) - a spelling I have never seen before - but fits the baptismal date.
(25) 14.10.1676
Wachtmeister Alexander Vrmi in der Baregg starb den 14. dito.
As the dates oft he previous entries cannot be identified clearly it could be 14 October (more likely) or November 1676. Anyway - this is Alexander, born 1618.
(15) 18.08.1676
Heÿni, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Ehelicher Söhnen einer, 17 Jahr vnd 12 Wochen Allt, der starb den 18. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
Ehelicher Söhnen einer = one of his legitimate sons.
(18) 30.08.1676 see previous topic
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in der Baregg, ehelicher 21-jähriger Sohn, starb den 30. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
(21) 01.09.1676
Elßeli, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Eheliches Eeinlef-Jähriges Töchterlj [minder XI wochen] Starb den 1. tag Septembris [1676].
Eeinlef = elf (eleven) - a spelling I have never seen before - but fits the baptismal date.
(25) 14.10.1676
Wachtmeister Alexander Vrmi in der Baregg starb den 14. dito.
As the dates oft he previous entries cannot be identified clearly it could be 14 October (more likely) or November 1676. Anyway - this is Alexander, born 1618.
Translation of the above:
(15) 18.08.1676
Heÿni, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Married sons of one, 17 years and 12 weeks old, who died on the 18th ditto [August month 1696].
Ehelicher Söhnen einer = one of his legitimate sons.
(18) 30.08.1676 see previous topic
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in the Baregg, legitimate 21-year-old son, died the 30th ditto [August month 1696].
(21) 01.09.1676
Elßeli, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg, married eleven-year-old daughter [less than XI weeks] died the 1st day of September [1676].
Eeinlef = elf (eleven) - a spelling I have never seen before - but fits the baptismal date.
(25) 14.10.1676
Constable Alexander Vrmi in the Baregg died the 14th ditto.
As the dates oft he previous entries cannot be identified clearly it could be 14 October (more likely) or November 1676. Anyway - this is Alexander, born 1618.
Heÿni, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg Married sons of one, 17 years and 12 weeks old, who died on the 18th ditto [August month 1696].
Ehelicher Söhnen einer = one of his legitimate sons.
(18) 30.08.1676 see previous topic
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in the Baregg, legitimate 21-year-old son, died the 30th ditto [August month 1696].
(21) 01.09.1676
Elßeli, Xander Vrmiß in der Baregg, married eleven-year-old daughter [less than XI weeks] died the 1st day of September [1676].
Eeinlef = elf (eleven) - a spelling I have never seen before - but fits the baptismal date.
(25) 14.10.1676
Constable Alexander Vrmi in the Baregg died the 14th ditto.
As the dates oft he previous entries cannot be identified clearly it could be 14 October (more likely) or November 1676. Anyway - this is Alexander, born 1618.
Wolf:
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in der Baregg, ehelicher 21-jähriger Sohn, starb den 30. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
Note: So this is not Alexander's death entry, but his son's: Hans Jakob died at the age of 21 - i.e. born about 1655.
Hanß Jacob, Alexander Vrmiß, in der Baregg, ehelicher 21-jähriger Sohn, starb den 30. dito [Augstmonat 1696].
Note: So this is not Alexander's death entry, but his son's: Hans Jakob died at the age of 21 - i.e. born about 1655.
 |
| 1678 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis - Baregger Anna Lüssi, Film 008126303 page 540 |
III Baregg
Vnden für dem Hof Buch
A. Anna Leüssin; Vander (= Alexander) Vrmiß Sël(ig) Eheliche hinderlassene Wittfr(au)w, Deren Kinder.
1. Verena - 32 Jahr vnd 6 w(ochen), dienet zu Zwilliken
2. Anna - 27 Jahr vnd 3 woch(en), dienet im Buch
3. Jagli - 25½ Jahr vnd 15 w(ochen), dienet zu Mëttma(n)stetten
4. Arbogast - 21 Jahr vnd 18 woch(en). Ist wol-erfahren in Catecheticis; v(nd) communiciert.
5. Hanß Rudj - 17 Jahr vnd 17 woch(en). Recitat Testimonia [S(cit)?] vnd kann die vorgehenden Stuck [..]
6. Vrendlj - 16 Jahr vnd 3 woch(en). Scit fragmenta.
7. Barbelj - 8 Jährig vnd 8 wöchig, scit Triadem püopularem.
Ibidem Ehe-Leüth:
Vllj Vrmj; deren obverzeichneten Kinderen Bruder vnnd Rëgel Vollenweider
Missing on the list is Margreth (≈ 09.05.1647 > 31 years) who in 1683 lives with her brother Arbogast.
DeepL"
Wolf:
III Baregg
Vnden for the Buch farm
A. Anna Leüssin; Vander (= Alexander) Vrmiß Sël(ig) Eheliche hinderlassene Wittfr(au)w, Deren Kinder.
1. Verena - 32 years and 6 weeks, serves at Zwilliken
2. Anna - 27 years and 3 weeks, serves in the book
3. Jagli - 25½ years and 15 weeks, serves at Mëttma(n)stetten
4. Arbogast - 21 years and 18 weeks. Is well experienced in catechetics; communicates.
5. Hanß Rudj - 17 years and 17 weeks. Recitat Testimonia [S(cit)?] vnd kann die vorgehenden Stuck [...]
6. Vrendlj - 16 years and 3 week(s). Scit fragmenta.
7. Barbelj - 8 years and 8 weeks, scit Triadem püopularem.
Ibidem Ehe-Leüth:
Vllj Vrmj; their above-mentioned children brother vnnd Rëgel VollenweiderMissing on the list is Margreth (≈ 09.05.1647 > 31 years) who in 1683 lives with her brother Arbogast.
 |
| 1683 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis - Baregger film 008126301 page 871 |
 |
| 1683 Bevölkerungsverzeichnis - Baregger film 008126301 page 871 |
griffy:
C-4-3) Margreth Urmi (≈ 09.05.1647) in the population register 1683 (reading aid)
I rather read:
Margreth Urmi his booster arbetselligen
leibs
arbetselligen = laborious
C-4-3) Margreth Urmi (≈ 09.05.1647) in the population register 1683 (reading aid)
I rather read:
Margreth Urmi his booster arbetselligen
leibs
arbetselligen = laborious
griffy:
"I rather read:
Margreth Urmi sein Schwoster arbetselligen leibs
arbetselligen = laborious"
Wolf: That's more or less what I had read - but I wanted to get a “second opinion” because I couldn't imagine what “arbet selligen” meant. Now (so “too late”) I looked it up in the Idiotikon:
1. full of work, toil, external hardship and pain of soul (in subj. and obj. sens.), poor, miserable, afflicted, unhappy
2. miserable in the moral and theological sense, corrupt, depraved, deluded
3. frail, crippled, sick, therefore unfit for work; also in a mental sense, unfit for work
Wolf question:
In 1683 Margreth lives with her brother Arbogast in Baregg: please help me read the rest of the line.
Säntis answer:
Hello Wolf,
In 1683 Margreth lives with her brother Arbogast in Baregg: please help me read the rest of the line.
Säntis answer:
Hello Wolf,
111
Arbogast Urmi of single status
Margreth Urmi his sister arbast selligen
Wibs.
Wolf:
Following are Hoff (farm) Buch and Baregg
1 Vli Vrmi / Regula Vollenweider (oo 03.03.1678)
Kinder: Hanßli (3), Anneli (1½)
11 Jaggeli Vrmi dermal (earlier) in Buch / Adelheit Funck
Diße habend by sich des Mans Schwöster Barbeli Vrmi (13)
They have with them the husband's sister Barbara Urmi (≈ 09.03.1670)
111 Arbogast Vrmi ledigen Stands (not married - gets married 14.11.1683)
Margreth Vrmi sein Schwöster .... ....... leibs.
Cannot decipher two words with confidence - but assume his sister Margreth was pregnant; check 1783/84 for an illegitimate child of a Margreth Urmi
15 Felix …. Wäber (weaver) / Margretha Meÿerin
I am not sure about this entry (cannot find a marriage record) - but definitely not an Urmi.
Following are Hoff (farm) Buch and Baregg
1 Vli Vrmi / Regula Vollenweider (oo 03.03.1678)Children: Hanßli (3), Anneli (1½)
11 Jaggeli Vrmi dermal (earlier) in Buch / Adelheit Funck
They have with them the husband's sworn husband Barbeli Vrmi (13)
They have with them the husband's sister Barbara Urmi (≈ 09.03.1670)
111 Arbogast Vrmi single status (not married - gets married 14.11.1683)
11 Jaggeli Vrmi dermal (earlier) in Buch / Adelheit Funck
They have with them the husband's sworn husband Barbeli Vrmi (13)
They have with them the husband's sister Barbara Urmi (≈ 09.03.1670)
111 Arbogast Vrmi single status (not married - gets married 14.11.1683)
C-4-10-1) Rudi Urmi oo 1713 Barbara Weilenmann (in Maschwanden)
Rudi Urmi, ≈ Knonau 10.12.1684, son of Arbogast, innkeeper and weaver. “Had as long as he worked in the trade a good ... ... .... ... the innkeeper's house dissolute: and devoted to drink.”
oo Maschwanden 22.11.1713 (married 1713)
Barbara Weilenmann, ≈ 09.06.1689, Heini's daughter
Children:
07.11.1714 Hans >>> Maschwanden
25.07.1717 Hans Jacob
13.__.1719 Rudi
08.10.1721 Anna
Source: Maschwanden family register 1721/22 (E III 73.6) with additions
Margreth Vrmi his sworn wife .... ....... leibs.
Cannot decipher two words with confidence - but assume his sister Margreth was pregnant; check 1783/84 for an illegitimate child of a Margreth Urmi
15 Felix .... Wäber (weaver) / Margretha Meÿerin
I am not sure about this entry (cannot find a marriage record) - but definitely not an Urmi. (new info, this is Alexander's son b 1654)
Rudi Urmi, ≈ Knonau 10.12.1684, son of Arbogast, innkeeper and weaver. “Had as long as he worked in the trade a good ... ... .... ... the innkeeper's house dissolute: and devoted to drink.”
oo Maschwanden 22.11.1713 (married 1713)
Barbara Weilenmann, ≈ 09.06.1689, Heini's daughter
Children:
07.11.1714 Hans >>> Maschwanden
25.07.1717 Hans Jacob
13.__.1719 Rudi
08.10.1721 Anna
Source: Maschwanden family register 1721/22 (E III 73.6) with additions
Margreth Vrmi his sworn wife .... ....... leibs.
Cannot decipher two words with confidence - but assume his sister Margreth was pregnant; check 1783/84 for an illegitimate child of a Margreth Urmi
15 Felix .... Wäber (weaver) / Margretha Meÿerin
I am not sure about this entry (cannot find a marriage record) - but definitely not an Urmi. (new info, this is Alexander's son b 1654)
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| 1683 Arbogast ? 14.11.1683 and Verena Urmi 12.05.1683 marriage Knonau film 008014288 page 355 |
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| 1702 Anna Urmi bap 11 June. Father Arbogast mother Regula Ehrenstärgerin Knonau film 008014288 page 156jpg 2 |
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| 1721 Rudi Urmi Familybook Maschwanden family register 1721-22 (E III 73.6) with additions film 008826953 page 364 |
Wolf:
C-4-10-1) Rudi Urmi oo 1713 Barbara Weilenmann (in Maschwanden)
Unread post by Wolf “ Wed 25 Sep 2024, 12:20
Rudi Urmi, ≈ Knonau 10.12.1684, son of Arbogast, innkeeper and weaver. “Had as long as he worked in the trade a good ... ... .... ... the innkeeper's house dissolute: and devoted to drink.”
Note: (Rudi was the innkeeper, weaver and prone to drink)
oo Maschwanden 22.11.1713
Barbara Weilenmann, ≈ 09.06.1689, Heini's daughter
Children:
07.11.1714 Hans >>> Maschwanden
25.07.1717 Hans Jacob
13.__.1719 Rudi
08.10.1721 Anna
Source: Maschwanden family register 1721/22 (E III 73.6) with additions
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| 1825 Map including Knonau and Baregg film 008191932 page 433 The page before this map says 1825. |
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| Baareguth center, Knonau on the left. |
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| Ottenbach to Knonau 5.5 miles.You could walk this distance. |
Birth
09 Dec 1618 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
16201
Birth of sister Margaretha Urmi (1620–)
03 Sep 1620 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164324
Death of father Ulrich Urmi (–1643)
28 Mar 1643 • Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164324
164425
Birth of daughter Barbara Urmi (1644–)
13 Nov 1644 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164627
Birth of daughter Verena Urmi (1646–)
27 Mar 1646 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164728
Birth of daughter Margareth Urmi (1647–)
09 May 1647 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164829
Birth of son Ulrich Urmi (1648–1649)
27 Aug 1648 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164930
Death of son Ulrich Urmi (1648–1649)
20 Jan 1649 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
164931
Birth of son Ulrich Urmi (1649–)
16 Dec 1649 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165132
Birth of daughter Anna Urmi (1651–)
31 Mar 1651 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165233
Birth of son Jakob Urmi (1652–)
18 Jul 1652 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165436
Birth of son Felix Urmi (1654–)
1654 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165536
Birth of son Hans Jakob Urmi (1655–)
02 Sep 1655 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165738
Birth of son Arbogast Urmi (1657–1736)
01 Jan 1657 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
165940
Birth of son Heinrich Urmi (1659–1672)
29 May 1659 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
166142
Birth of son Hans Rudolf Urmi (1661–)
06 Jan 1661 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
166243
Birth of daughter Verena Urmi (1662–1683)
13 Apr 1662 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
166445
Birth of son Alexander Urmi (1664–1671)
13 Mar 1664 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
166546
Birth of daughter Elisabeth Urmi (1665–1676)
19 Nov 1665 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
167051
Birth of daughter Barbara Urmi (1670–)
09 Mar 1670 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
167153
Death of son Alexander Urmi (1664–1671)
1671
167254
Death of son Heinrich Urmi (1659–1672)
1672
167658
Death of daughter Elisabeth Urmi (1665–1676)
1676
168364
Death of daughter Verena Urmi (1662–1683)
12 May 1683 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland
1736117
Death of son Arbogast Urmi (1657–1736)
23 Nov 1736 • Baregg, Knonau, Zürich, Switzerland