Rudolf Sidler 1612-1675

Rudolf Sidler married Veronica Frey.  Rudolf's childhood included chaos resulting from the 30 years war. They had 4 children. Three married. Rudolf died 28 September 1675. Rudolf and Veronica had a large posterity.

Rudolf Sidler, Ottenbach 16.Feb.1612, Sohn des Hans, + Ottenbach 28 September  1675 
Veronica Frey, * 1615, + 30.11.1684
Kinder:
12.01.1640 Barbara, oo 16 Oct 1661 Hans Jakob Huber, + 21.March.1710
12. Dec 1641 Hans, oo 06 Dec 1664 Katharina Huber (See document below)
25.Feb 1644 Rudolf
24.Oct 1647 Hans Kaspar, oo 11.Dec.1677 Barbara Gut

During their lives:

1618 - 1649 The balance of power between the Reformed and Catholic estates leads the Confederation to stay out of the Thirty Years' War. (Ottenbach Municipality Website)

1600 - 1800 Switzerland is a loose confederacy of 13 cities and small valley communities dominating the rest of the country. A few families control state

The Thirty Years' War was a war fought in Central Europe between 1618 and 1648. One of the most destructive conflicts in human history, it resulted in eight million fatalities not only from military engagements but also from violence, famine, and plague but the Swiss confederacy is a "peaceful island." (Wikipedia and Ottenbach Municipality)

1661  Construction of the first Ottenbach schoolhouse

1645 - 1647 Construction of a mill wheel on the Reuss river

1638   Construction of the Ottenbach rectory. (Ottenbach Municipality Website)

1640 In Ottenbach there are 52 adults, 42 single, 319 inhabitants, 6.1 per household or 52 homes in the community. (Ottenbach Told by Bernard Schnider and Salomon Schneider and Erika Schmid) 

Documents related to Rudolf Sidler:

Rudolf Sidler birth 16 February 1612 film 8014328 page 79

Wolf:
(Sunday) 16. Febru(ar) [1612]
E(ltern): Hans Sÿdler, Cathrin Kleinerin
K(ind): Rudolff
Z(eugen): Rudolff Huber von Bostetten (= Bonstetten), Anna Stelin, Melch(ior) Steiners Frouw
Anna Stehli and Melchior Steiner got married in Ottenbach 06.02.1597.

1615 Veronica Frey 11 June baptism Knonau, Zürich, Schweiz page 81 

Wolf: 
Headings: Kind / Eltern / Götte / Gotte / Tag / Monat
child / parents / godfather / godmother / day / month
Fronegk ein eh(liches) 

Kind (Veronika or Verena)
Parents: Lienhardt Freÿ, Anna Fosterin, zu Knonauw (Lienhard Frei and Anna Forster got married 13 December 1612 in Knonau: spelling "Foster" mentioned)
Witnesses: Heinrich Hegetschwiller (Hegetschweiler) zu Kn(onauw)
Fronegk Hoffstetterin (Hofstetter) zu Knonauw
Date: 11 Junij [1615]

1640 Ottenbach 12 Jan baptism Barbara Sidler page 135  

Wolf:
Den 12. tag Jenner [1640]
Rudlj Sidler von Ottenbach / Veronica Freÿin
Barbara
Witnesses: Jost Schneewlin / Barbara Wÿdlerin (beide von Ottenbach)
The 12th day of January
Note: Both, Widler and Wydler, are official spellings for Ottenbach citizens today. Whether they have a common ancestor (and, if yes, when the two lines split), I don't know.

1641 Hans Sidler baptism 12 Dec Ottenbach page 140 

Wolf:

Date: den 12.ten tag 10bris [1641] (12.12.1641)
Parents: Rudli Sÿdler von Ottenbach / Veronica Freÿin
Kinder: Hanß
Witnesses: Hanß Gutt von Nider Lummeren / Anna Stehlin von Ober Lummeren

1644 Hans Jogli, bapt. 25.02.1644 film 008014328 page 144 

Wolf:
Great - you have found the "missing link" - which also helps to solve the name problem (Hans Jogli vs. Rudolf).
Den 25.ten Febru(uar) [1644]
(Eltern): Rudi Sÿdler allhir, Veronegk Freÿin
Kind: Hans Joggli
Zeügen: Hanß Jogli (added marked +) Steiner vnd Verena Sigerstin (Sigerist)
Note: I have described the solution on Geneal-Forum: Billeter's misunderstanding will likely have been caused by the subsequent entry of the baptism. The name of the child baptised on 25 February (Hanß Joggli) appears under the entry ‘Kind’ - but in the same line next to it is the name of the father (Rudli) of the child baptised on 3 March.

1647 Hans Kaspar Sidler baptism 24 Oct Ottenbach page 152 

Kent: 

I added Bevölkerungsverzeichnisses for 1646, 1670 and 1678 below. 

The one for 1678 has lots of dates and family relationships. In the 

1678 Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse I assume everyone in a single 

box are family (like a family group sheet), not that they necessarily 

live together although they may. 

1646 Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse Rudolf Sidler
Veronica Frey film 8126305 page 7332  

1670  Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse film 007765846 page 381 

Pastor Hans Kaspar Huber did an excellent job in 1678!

When Hans Caspar Huber was born on 2 October 1627, in Affoltern am Albis, Zürich, Switzerland, his father, Hans Ulrich Huber, was 29 and his mother, Anna Burri, was 25. He married Anna Maria Engelfried on 7 March 1654. They were the parents of at least 2 sons and 4 daughters. Kaspar served as the Pastor in Ottenbach from 1677 until his death. He suffered a stroke and died at the age of 69, and was buried in Ottenbach, Zürich, Switzerland.  FS ID: MJ3V-D68

1678 Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse Rudolf Sidler and
Veronica Frey film 8126303 page 467

Veronica Frey is listed as a widow because Rudolf died 28 September 1675

The second family is Hans Sidler born 12 Dec 1641 and his wife Catharina Huber: K2MP-WTF

The third family is Rudolf Sidler and his wife Anna Biehl: GYWM-B8W

The last family is Caspar Sidler and his wife Barbara Gut: K895-YQP

Kent: What is the word before Hans born 1641? Klein? meaning small?

Wolf: Correct - small more in the sense of younger: Kleinhans is not an "official" name, but used in the family (or even the community) to differentiate him from another, older Hans - here most likely his grandfather.

Wolf: "Rudi Sÿdler der alt" indicates that there is (at least was) a "Rudi der jung" around. Do you know of a suitable candidate? Billeter has this Rudolf bapt. 25.02.1644 - who according to the Bevölkerungsverzeichnis was named Hans Jagli …. have you checked this baptismal date yet?  

Restatement of the Problem: According to Billeter, a Rudolf is baptized on 25.02.1644 - but the population register of 1678 confirms the name Hans Jogli. Hans Jogli is also given as 26 years old in 1670 - only in 1646 is he not mentioned (only Barbara with 7 and Hans with 6).Billeter's misunderstanding was probably caused by the subsequent entry of the baptism:

The name of the child baptized on 25.02. (Hanß Joggli) appears under the entry “Child” - but in the same line next to it is the name of the father (Rudli) of the child baptized on 03.03.

1689 Young Hans Sidler in Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse film 00814133  
page 333 

Wolf:
Kleinhanß Seidler, Kilchmejer
Chilch-/Kilch- is dialect for Kirch-… / Meier is an administrator - could be at very different levels. Idiotikondescribes two situations:
1. Administrator of the church property (but usually only a subordinate assistant to the recipient of the church interest).
2. Head of the parish.
Under the circumstances I tend towards (2).
BTW - 1689 - not 1889.

1689 Ottenbach Bevölkerungsverzeichniss film 008014133 page 336

Kent: Also what is the word between his name and his birth date on his entry in the Bevölkerungsverzeichnis? Just below the title page. It looks like the same word on the title page and on his entry.
Correct - again "Kilchmejer".
Wolf: BTW - I have summarized the Bevölkerungsverzeichnis on https://www.geneal-forum.com/phpbb/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=127939#p127987 (again, please don't post there for the time being), confirming Billeter - with the exception of an obvious typo: Heinrich got married 1700 - not 1800 ;-).

12 Dec 1641 Hans, oo 06 Dec 1664 Katharina Huber

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 13

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 19

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 22

Wolf: 

Hans Kaspar Sidler oo Barbara Gut
Hans Kaspar Sidler, ≈ Ottenbach 24.10.1647, Sohn von Rudolf
oo Ottenbach 11.12.1677
Barbara Gut, ≈ 17.02.1656, + 06.05.1728
Kinder:
08.12.1678 Hans Rudolf, ooI 14.12.1706 Anna Schneebeli, ooII 08.12.1716 Adelheid Meili, + 31.01.1768
25.12.1680 Melchior, oo 15.11.1718 Katharina Sidler, + 26.08.1759
11.12.1682 Elsbeth, oo 13.02.1703 Rudolf Gut, + 07.06.1756
24.02.1685 Marx, oo ..., + 01.09.1746
03.07.1687 Hans Rudolf, + 17.01.1697
17.03.1689 Heinrich, oo ..., + 31.01.1757
17.03.1695 Anna, oo 09.12.1727 Hans Gut, + 08.10.1758I 14.12.1706

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 27

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 28

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 29 - 30.

Sidler and Hegetschweiler Temple Record Book by Julius Billeter page 32

Rudolf Sidler burial 28 September 1675 film 8014328 page 374

Wolf:
den 28.ten Septembris [1675]
Rudi Sÿdler der alt allhir zu Ottenbach

1684 Veronica Frey burial 30 Nov 1684 Ottenbach
film 8014328 page 380 

Wolf:
(Sunday) d(en) 30. 9br (November) [1684]
Vroneck Freÿin, Rudi Seidlers S(elig) v(on) Otenbach hinderlassne eheliche Witfrauw. 69-jährig.
Translation: hinderlassne eheliche Witfrauw=surviving marital widow

Re Bevölkerungsverzeichnis 1678: structure depended to some extent on the pastor writing it up - and also changed with time. The older records from e.g. Uster (where I had done some research many years ago) were organised per household: this does not necessarily mean that this holds for other parishes at different times as well.
Let's look at XXXIII from 1678: We have Rudi Seidlers widow - quite likely that she lived together with her eldest son and his family. And we have the two younger sons - both married but without children - again quite likely that they lived in the same house. I am not familiar with the situation in Ottenbach, but e.g. in Thurgau I had many situations where one "house" consisted of several "flats". So I consider it quite likely that all these people lived together - but cannot be sure.

1678 Bevölkerungsverzeichnisse Veronica Frey film 8126303 page 467